Ep. 108: Bigfoot the Forest Poltergeist

[00:00:03] And I just turned around and I pulled ass out of there. I was done. I wasn't dealing with that. The hypocrisy of the cult is one of the things that turned me away the quickest. When I turned my headlights on, it turned and looked at us.

[00:00:25] And one of the things I remember the most were the eyes were glowing red. I see an orb of light. It is just circling these steps like it is waiting for me. And he begins to tell them that he saw UFO. They're basically like, what are you?

[00:00:51] That's seven foot up on a tree peeking around it. And that's where I saw the top of the muzzle, nose and the eyes. As soon as I made eye contact with this thing, it felt like death. Welcome back to Tinfoil Tales. I'm your host, Brandon Wright.

[00:01:10] Tonight's episode we're going to be joined by author W.T. Watson. But I refer to him as Travis. He is a author of several different paranormal books. Looking to dive into a lot of the stuff that he's been researching.

[00:01:24] But before we bring him on, you've ever had an experience or a story you'd like to share and you'd like to be on an episode of Tinfoil Tales? There's two things you can do. You can either send me an email at tinfoiltalespodcast.gmail.com

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[00:03:28] Links for all that information is included in the show notes. So the Patreon, merch store, all that is in the show notes. This fall I will be appearing at four different events starting with Big Foot's and Brews and Spirits 2 on September 14th.

[00:03:43] That is in DeWaajak, Michigan at the Sister Lakes Brewing Company. It's being put on by my friend Eric Szilagyi from Uncomfortable Podcast. Make sure to check that out. On September 27th and 28th, I'll be at the First Annual Indiana Big Foot Conference down in Nashville, Indiana.

[00:04:00] Pickets for both of the Big Foot events are available in the show notes. And in October there will be two free events that are open to everyone. The first is Parity Unity 6 here in Miami County, Indiana at the 4-H Fairgrounds. That is on October 19th.

[00:04:15] And on October 26th, I'll be in Crawfordville, Indiana for the First Annual Crawfordville Paranormal Convention. Again, both of those events are free and they're all ages. So, bringing the whole family. I will be speaking at both the events in October, so come out and talk to me.

[00:04:31] All the events I will be at, I'll have my recording rig and I'll have some books and some shirts and some other stuff for you. So make sure to stop by my booth. If you got a story you'd like to share, you can sit down and record it.

[00:04:43] Make sure to follow me around on all the social medias. Facebook, Instagram, X. Look for Brandon Tend Foil Tells on Facebook. You can reach out to me that way too. I think now we're going to bring Travis on. Looking forward to talking with him.

[00:04:57] He's got some interesting books, so I'm sure he's got some interesting stories to talk about. I hope you guys enjoy the conversation. So sit back, relax and enjoy the show. I'd like to take this time to welcome my guest tonight, Travis.

[00:05:10] Thanks for coming on here and talking to me. Thanks for having me tonight, Brandon. It's good to have a chance to talk to the audience for Tend Foil Tells. I appreciate that. Do you want to let the audience know a little bit about yourself? So my, well, okay.

[00:05:31] I'm a researcher. I'm an author. I do many things. I write fiction and nonfiction both. My books are published under the name WT Watson. So some of you may have ventured across them before. I have kind of a long history in the paranormal.

[00:05:51] My dad was UFO Experiancer and shared his story with me back when I was eight years old. I'm 63 now, so I've been around for a while. His basic thing was back in the 50s he was in the Air Force. He was stationed in Southern California.

[00:06:14] He was coming home, coming back to base one night near San Bernardino. Had a classic back, you know, one of those classic 1950s UFO encounters where the, he saw a cigar shaped craft that hovered over the road in front of them. He forced them to stop.

[00:06:40] He was with a friend of his, herbal portals and the whole thing.

[00:06:45] He doesn't recall there having been any missing time or any of that sort of thing, but he from that time on, you know, anytime anybody said anything negative about UFOs, he was all over it because he's like, I saw one of those things.

[00:07:01] I know exactly, you know, I know what it's like. They're there. He was very much a supporter of the extraterrestrial hypothesis, extraterrestrial hypothesis, but that was kind of my intro into the weird. So, of course, you know, your father tells you a story like that.

[00:07:24] You know, you start to, at least I did start to get curious about things. And also, you know, I was eight. So I'd read a comic book about, about hauntings and between the two things I started reading everything I could find about UFOs and about hauntings.

[00:07:44] And I got interested in cryptage shortly after that. And by the time I was in sixth grade, I had read Ivan Sanderson's The Evolminable Snowman.

[00:07:55] So to say that I've been interested in the anomalous and the strange and the Forty and for, you know, literally decades is would be the truth. So fast forward. I got to be into my fifties. I moved to Canada.

[00:08:19] My spouse got a job teaching at the University of Waterloo. They're, they're native Canadian. So my wife was coming home and I was coming to a whole new adventure. But during the time period when I first immigrated here, of course, we were in the middle of the pandemic.

[00:08:40] I had published a novel with Beyond the Fray publishing. And they had asked me if I could do a book on the Phantom Black Dog apparition, which was the main character in my novel was associated with the Phantom Black Dogs.

[00:09:03] I moved to Canada and I had, you know, to wait to get my papers to be able to work. So I had a period of time where I really could do pretty much whatever I wanted. So I spent that time writing books.

[00:09:20] So during that time period, I wrote Phantom Black Dogs or I published Phantom Black Dogs Walkers The Liminal Way, which is about the Phantom Black Dog apparition that most people associate with Great Britain. Or the UK and Ireland, but is actually seen in Canada.

[00:09:40] There are Black Dog stories in the United States and also in South and Central America where there's a very vibrant history or lore of the Phantom Black Dog.

[00:09:52] I followed that up with a book called Mysteries in the Mist, which is all about mist fog and clouds in the paranormal. It's one of my favorite of my books because it covers a little bit of everything.

[00:10:05] If you're interested in the paranormal at all, there's a story and mysteries in the mist that will interest you. It's everything from cryptids to UFOs to time slips and other anomalous mist related occurrences where, you know, people would, there's stories in the book about people driving into mists

[00:10:27] and ending up in places that they didn't recognize finding out that they had traveled several hundred kilometers. So, you know, there's all kinds of fun weirdness in that one.

[00:10:42] Since I was living in Canada, I'd also decided that I wanted to explore some of the strangeness in my new home. And I published Canadian Monsters and Mysteries, which again is a compendium of a lot of different strange things that are known to happen here.

[00:11:08] Focus is a bit on the lake monsters that are so prevalent here in Canada. We have several different lakes that purport to have lake monsters in them. But I also talk about UFOs and, you know, and other bits of strangeness in Canada.

[00:11:30] For instance, the Giant Beavers, which was one of my favorite stories in the book. There are stories in part in more uninhabited parts of Canada about Giant Beavers. And there's actually a known fossil record creature that these critters could be. Like from the ice age?

[00:11:58] Yeah, it was called Castorides, Ohioansis if I remember correctly. Don't quote me on that. But these guys were actually Beavers that existed 10,000 years or so ago that existed that were the size of bears.

[00:12:16] Which is exactly what people, particularly people in the native population here in Canada were describing. It's just a monster. That's really, really big beaver, right? So that was one of my favorite things because everybody thinks, you know, when you think of Canada, people think of Beavers.

[00:12:35] They think of moose and those kinds of things. And so Giant Beavers seemed to fit right into the whole Canadian vibe. I followed that book up with Sasquatch Canada, which is my straight up research into class A sightings of Sasquatch.

[00:12:53] That is visual sightings of a Sasquatch here in Canada. I focused on, since everybody talks about BC, I focused on the provinces outside of BC. And I found Sasquatch sightings in all of those, in all of the provinces of Canada.

[00:13:14] The only one that I didn't find was Nunavut, which is way up north. It may have something to do with the landscape there, or it may have something to do with the majority of the people that live in Nunavut are into it.

[00:13:32] And they may just not be willing to share their stories. We don't know. They're not in available databases anyway. But there are tons of Sasquatch sightings here in Canada.

[00:13:47] And, you know, one of the things that I tell people all the time when I do podcasts or, you know, I'm talking to people about my books. We have hundreds of thousands of square kilometers of wilderness in Canada.

[00:14:01] It's the second largest country in the world has, I believe, the longest sea coast in the world. And there's all kinds of places you could hide a large, cryptid animal. For instance, we actually have a Lazarus species here in Canada.

[00:14:20] It's called the Woodbison that was pronounced extinct at the beginning of the, at the beginning of the 1900s and then was rediscovered in the 1950s by a park service employee who was flying over a park in Manitoba and found a whole herd of them.

[00:14:39] Now the Woodbison is actually the largest land animal in North America, not the tallest but the largest by weight. So if you can lose that for several decades, who knows what else you can lose in the Canadian wilderness.

[00:14:54] So, you know, I make a point of, you know, when I talk about my books of saying that I don't discount the idea that there could actually be a physical creature involved in Sasquatch sightings.

[00:15:10] I think there's a whole lot more to it, but I don't discount the idea that there could be a physical creature because there's plenty of room up here for there to be something like that.

[00:15:21] And then, you know, of course the Pacific Northwest and British Columbia and all of those places too. There's some very convincing sightings here in Canada.

[00:15:31] You also have some pretty weird sightings here in Canada where you start to get into that area where the creature that's being described obviously is not a physical animal. We have disappearing Sasquatch. We have Sasquatch that mentally communicate with people.

[00:15:53] We have the Sasquatch with the, you know, self-illuminating eyes and all of those sorts of things for people to take into consideration as they're looking at Sasquatch more. And the Woofactor. And finally, I'm sorry. They called the Woofactor. Yeah, yeah.

[00:16:14] You know, and I know that there are people in Sasquatch research who are just very much opposed to anything to do with the Woof.

[00:16:22] But unfortunately, there are enough witness accounts out there that include these really strange things that happen, you know, Sasquatch vanishing in front of somebody's eyes. Those kinds of things that, you know, we have to take those things into consideration.

[00:16:44] People are seeing something and whatever Sasquatch is may not always be, you know, a gigantipithecus or, you know, a giant bipedal primate. It may be something else, which brings us to my final book. The book that I have out right now is called Forrest Poltergeist.

[00:17:07] And one of the things that you notice when you start to do research into the Sasquatch phenomena is that there are a lot of what they call class A sightings. In other words, somebody visually saw a Sasquatch.

[00:17:28] They saw something walking through the woods or wherever it was that they happened to be. There are also a ton of what are called class B encounters.

[00:17:43] And in these things fascinated me because what happens in a class B encounter is that the person doesn't actually see a Sasquatch, but they have incidences of rock throwing. They have incidences of wood knocks. There are vocalizations, there may be footprints.

[00:18:04] There's all of these quote unquote signs of Sasquatch presence in the area, but nobody actually sees this critter. I was talking with another podcaster a while back.

[00:18:19] And he pointed out that if you took all of these things that people associate with Sasquatch out in the wilderness and you put it in a house, you'd have poltergeist case. And I said to him, okay, that's an interesting thought.

[00:18:36] Are you going to write a book about that by any chance? And he said no. He had too many other irons in the fire to try and write a book about that particular thing. And I asked him, so do you mind if I write a book about it?

[00:18:53] And he was gracious enough to let me borrow his idea and I took off with it. One of the things that I realized very quickly in doing the research for this book was you have a ton of Class B Sasquatch encounters.

[00:19:10] I mean, if you look at the BFRL website, for instance, you just find dozens and dozens and dozens and dozens of these things. And when you go to research the lore of poltergeists, you have psychical research that goes back to, you know, the 1800s.

[00:19:33] And there are probably thousands of poltergeist cases that you can get into. So it's a very deep rabbit hole to go into either side, either Sasquatch lore or poltergeist lore. So I had to be very choosy about the poltergeist cases that I talked about.

[00:19:56] And I had to kind of pick and choose the Class B encounters that I talked about in this book so that, you know, I didn't end up writing a three volume set. My books are all very digestible length. I intend them to be an introduction to an idea.

[00:20:17] And then I give people bibliographical references so that if they want to go deeper, they can do that. That's kind of how I approach things. So the basic rust of the forest poltergeist is that we need to, you know, as researchers stop siloing.

[00:20:44] If you talk to people in the paranormal field, excuse me, if you talk to people in the paranormal field, you very quickly realize that people tend to get into a particular field of research and stay there.

[00:21:05] You know, the Sasquatch researchers are researching Sasquatches and the UFO researchers are researching UFOs and the ghost hunters were hunting ghosts. And yeah, and they don't look at the similarities or the commonalities that you can find throughout all of this paranormal stuff, all of this different stuff.

[00:21:34] I mean, a lot of people would argue that Sasquatches are paranormal. I would argue right back with them, but all of these things that people are looking at, if they would stop and look at what's going on in some of these other fields,

[00:21:51] they might find some interesting areas of research to follow. And that's kind of, that's the impetus behind the forest poltergeist is the idea that I'm taking what everybody is assuming is

[00:22:08] a presence of a giant bipedal primate in the wilderness and saying, look, it doesn't necessarily have to be that. Every single thing that you tell me about that you were pointing at as a evidence that Sasquatches out there.

[00:22:34] I can point to a poltergeist case and say, yeah, but this this phenomenon is doing that as well. And that's that was the thing that I wanted to do is to get people to think outside that box because it's so much the case that we do.

[00:22:54] Yeah, we like our we like our rituals and we like our our, our, you know, protocols and our standard ways of thinking because it means we don't have to spend too much time, you know, burning brain cells on it.

[00:23:07] But sometimes when you have, you know, when you're faced with the unknown, you have to step outside those boxes and look at, you know, different disciplines. And that's, that's basically the thrust of the book. You mentioned some stuff from your other books that.

[00:23:30] Take my entry mentioned like monsters and I've said it many times I wish I could get someone to have an eye witness account with a like monster is like to have that interview.

[00:23:39] It's all yeah, those have always been like the Loch Ness monster, like and champ up in Lake Champlain and like all those other ones. Like those are all stuff that I was hugely into when I was a kid. I'm a huge Godzilla fan.

[00:23:55] So he comes out of the water. Oh, oh me too. Yeah. So I have a model of the big guy that sits on my desk that my my stepson brought me back from the Shinjuku in Tokyo. That's awesome.

[00:24:12] So I just he's one of my he's one of my my mascots on my desk where I work. I've got but yeah, I mean there are yeah, there are several lakes in Tokyo.

[00:24:28] There are lakes in Canada that have you know, have these monster sightings probably the most notable being Lake Okanagan, which is the the critter they call Ogopogo.

[00:24:42] And those those sightings go back into the the 1700s back in well probably before that the native people in that area knew about whatever it was that lived in the lake. And you know basically warned the settlers about it.

[00:25:00] And some of those settlers found out to their detriment that the Indians weren't you know, weren't blowing smoke that you know, actually was the case that there there was something in that lake.

[00:25:14] And those sightings have continued up to as far as I'm aware up to the present day. So yeah, I mean I was fascinated by Loch Ness too when I was a kid. That was another one of my one of my areas. My mother was actually born in Scotland.

[00:25:32] So when I heard about Loch Ness it was kind of like oh it's my you know it's like my national cryptid right. So yeah, Lake Monster cases are you know on the one hand.

[00:25:50] You know there's something peculiar going on because it seems like these cases happen in a sort of a narrow band of you know, latitude. They happen in these very deep, very cold lakes and places like Canada and Scotland and even Russia.

[00:26:20] I can't recall of a Russian Lake Monster right off the top of my head but I know that there are instances there as well. Now what is it about these still deep cold dark lakes that you know seems to attract this phenomena.

[00:26:42] It seems like it would be very difficult for an actual physical creature to to survive in a limited space like that. I know there have been tons of arguments about oh well there are many trout and Loch Ness blah blah.

[00:27:04] We're talking about what seems to be a fairly sizable critter and you know if you're going to have any kind of breeding population there has to be more than one. So, oh is it that these animals are surviving and how is it that they are avoiding detection.

[00:27:29] Even though again you know there are instances of anomalous sonar readings in Loch Ness. The lake name has slipped my mind it might be Simcoe here in Canada that has its own little lake monster that there are claims that there is sonar of this critter too.

[00:27:54] And again this is not a lake that is really large enough to support a large number of or even a small number of you know fairly hefty lake monsters whatever those happen to be whatever that is.

[00:28:11] I mean I was all into the Plesiosaur theory when I was a kid.

[00:28:15] You know I mean I've discovered since then that you know there are people who believe that some of these lake monsters are a known species of pen and pet which is you know a likely scenario as well.

[00:28:29] I mean lots of theorizing but not a lot of answers when it comes to why it is that lake monsters seem to appear in you know very specific types of lakes.

[00:28:44] I mean is there something about the you know the energy of the land or the energy of the water that's attracting whatever it is that's manifesting these phenomena.

[00:29:01] It's just super mysterious and kind of creepy and you know Loch Ness is one of those places that's on my bucket list of places to go when I retire. I would love to go there.

[00:29:14] I'd really love to see it you know up close and you know see if I can do a conjuration on the lakeshores and have the monster appear or something.

[00:29:24] Yeah you kind of were going down the path that I was just kind of thinking about is we mentioned the woo factor for Sasquatch encounters and stuff but maybe something like that's what these lake monsters manifest from too.

[00:29:40] Well yeah I mean there is I'm going to back up into another cryptid and one that I haven't spent a lot of time covering but because the late great Linda Godfrey did such a terrific job of it.

[00:29:55] But you know when Linda Godfrey was doing her research into the man wolf or dog man phenomena. She had the opportunity to talk to some some native folks and actually discuss with a whole chunk elder.

[00:30:16] What he thought in this case she was asking about Sasquatch and he told her straight up. Oh well these are beings that live in the other world and they can come into our world.

[00:30:29] They assume a physical form when they're here and then when they're ready to go back they go back which you know I mean makes a lot of sense to me.

[00:30:41] It would explain a lot of things because yeah I mean you have Sasquatch encounters in places where a large bipedal primate shouldn't exist.

[00:30:53] You know I mean it's one thing to talk about Sasquatch in the wilds of Canada you know and the possibility that that might be a an actual thing an actual real animal physical animal.

[00:31:10] It's another thing though when you start having people reporting Sasquatches on you know in the deserts of Arizona. Where is a creature like that going to hide in Arizona.

[00:31:25] Now northern Arizona yes you know you have ponderosa pine forests and stuff up there but some of the areas that are reporting Sasquatches Sasquatch sightings are you know very open and very little cover.

[00:31:43] I mean there might be some caves or whatever but Sasquatch would have to live a pretty lonely existence I think and only come out at night if it were going to try to live in a place like that.

[00:31:55] You know and we have again these class B encounters where people are encountering rock throwing and wood knocking and rock clacking and mumbling voices and bipedal footsteps and all this kind of thing.

[00:32:16] Which again you know can all be attributed you know are being attributed to Sasquatch but can just as easily be a part of the poltergeist phenomena whatever that turns out to be.

[00:32:31] And it you know again you get that kind of woof factor you get there's something more going on here maybe there's something interdimensional going on here. You know I like to just call it the other world. You know I'm a very animistic thinker.

[00:32:53] And so I believe that there are you know that we live in a vast ecosystem that is composed of not just physical corporeal forms but also spiritual forms.

[00:33:07] And you know some of those spiritual forms may be may be capable of making themselves manifest in our plane for certain periods of time.

[00:33:18] You know I mean and you have I mean if you remember the the psychical research on physical mediums and some of the strange things that happened in association with the with those guys.

[00:33:33] You know what was his name home you know flying out one window and flying into another window. There's all kinds of stuff out there all kinds of weird things out there that argue that there is a woo dimension.

[00:33:51] You know however you want to call that and you know I mean I know that a lot of people are like oh well you know if we start to believe that that then you know.

[00:34:04] UFOs aren't nuts and bolts craft and you know Sasquatch aren't aren't you know these physical bipedal primates and and that sort of thing you know and all of our belief systems are going to kind of get blown up.

[00:34:20] And honestly I think maybe some of those belief systems need to get blown up because they're they're limiting their they're very limiting. I am what I call a both and thinker you know instead of an either or thinker it's either this thing or that thing.

[00:34:40] I like to think that there are a whole bunch of different things that could account for some of the strange strangeness that we see in our world.

[00:34:51] When I talk about what a poltergeist is or you know what what the forest poltergeist is and in my my most recent book. Now I talk about things like the fact that some of these things may be human manifestations of human powers.

[00:35:12] You know the poltergeist is associated with something called RSPK random or random spontaneous psycho kinesis yeah RSPK which was the theory of William Rawls and some other parapsychologist that. Most most poltergeist cases have a focus. The the phenomena tends to occur around.

[00:35:43] One particular person in the house more than than anybody else and that their their theory is that oftentimes these are our children or adolescents or people who are in some other way.

[00:35:58] Repressed and so essentially poltergeists are a psychic temper temper tantrum these kids or people apparently have some kind of a psycho kinetic gift and so when they are put into situations where they can express themselves outwardly then that.

[00:36:22] Impulse translates into psycho kinetic activity and you know and I don't discount that idea. I mean we know that the PK micro PK at least has been pretty well proven in you know double blind laboratory studies where they're using random random number generation and that kind of thing.

[00:36:45] The case for macro PK is more anecdotal. You know stories of people who've been able to do these things but you know it's just one of many human powers that could be responsible for some of the weird stuff that happens around us.

[00:37:04] Another thing is the idea of you know some people like to call them Tulpas I think that's kind of appropriate to have a Tibetan culture so I call them. It's not just a theory of thought forms.

[00:37:18] Since idea that given a very clear visual image, giving a lot of desire and and given the idea to sort of novelize an image, we can actually create things. that have a more or less solid form from just our minds, basically.

[00:37:42] I think it was, might have been John Keel, but don't quote me on that, who tells the story of the home of the fellow who used to write The Shadow, the radio character, his home being haunted by a figure that looked like The Shadow.

[00:38:04] So you had a guy who spent a period of time, the very clear image in his mind, who was bringing this character to life and who had a strong, you know, force or desire to bring this character to life. And apparently it's been so.

[00:38:26] There are stories in the magical communities about, you know, groups of practitioners getting into their lives. Practitioners getting together and creating thought forms that, for instance, protect certain areas.

[00:38:42] I read of one group of witches that did a working to try and develop a guardian for an island where baby seals were being killed.

[00:38:53] And subsequently this figure that they had created because they'd gone, they'd made a painting of it and they spent a lot of time and energy creating this thought form and putting it out there. And apparently this thing was seen on this island. So, you know, there's another thing.

[00:39:10] You have one we're talking about Sasquatch for instance. We have groups of people out there who have a strong, strong desire to see a Sasquatch. We have people who have a very clear visual image of what a Sasquatch looks like, you know.

[00:39:30] And then we also, and we have these same people who have gone to great lengths to develop a story for the Sasquatch. You know, this is how they behave. This is how they hunt. This is what they do. This is their migration.

[00:39:46] I mean, you know, you talk to some of these folks, they have very, very intense stories about how Sasquatch is. Is it not possible that some of these groups, you know, are putting so much energy into this that they're actually creating their own Sasquatch? Could be. Could be.

[00:40:08] So you see we have all of these different things that could be going on if we take a more fordian approach to the paranormal. When you talk about the forest poltergeist, you can also be talking about the Fairfolk.

[00:40:28] You know, the fey have a strong reputation for creating poltergeisty type activity, especially when you know you've invaded their territory and they don't approve of whatever it is that you're doing.

[00:40:43] There are stories of people walking into fairy circles and trying to join the dance and literally being knocked out.

[00:40:53] So, and there are stories of people building their homes on what was known as a fairy path supposedly a path that the Fairfolk used for traveling from one place to the other during different seasons.

[00:41:10] If you built your home on one of those paths, it was almost certain to cause you trouble. In one case that I read about there were deaths in the family as a result.

[00:41:22] In another case, there was an outbreak of what looked like poltergeist activity until they actually shaped their house so that it wasn't encroaching on this path.

[00:41:32] So, I mean, my point is in all this is that any of these phenomena that we look at whether it's lake monsters, whether it's Sasquatch, whether we're talking about UFOs or ghosts or whatever.

[00:41:49] There are a lot of different things that could be happening, you know, ranging from human cause things to spirit cause things and including physical phenomena as well.

[00:42:03] I mean, you know in the Sasquatch instance as I said, I don't have a problem believing that there's a large bipedal primate out there somewhere. You know, but if somebody brings one in tomorrow, that doesn't solve the mystery. That solves part of the mystery.

[00:42:21] But you still can't explain stories like the one in Stan Gordon's book where the woman is sitting in her living room and she's watching TV. She hears the noise on her porch.

[00:42:33] She's had a problem with feral dogs in neighborhood, so she scoops up her shotgun, goes out on the porch and confronts a seven foot tall Sasquatch on her porch.

[00:42:45] Well, apparently the Sasquatch is as surprised as she is to see the thing. It throws its hands up. She thinks she's being attacked. She shoots the thing and it disappears in a flash of light. Now that's obviously not a physical creature.

[00:43:03] You know, so even if all of these researchers manage to produce a physical specimen someday, that's only going to answer part of the story.

[00:43:17] I think that you're still going to see a lot of these force poltergeist type class B encounters happening out in the woods because I don't think that it's just about Sasquatch. You know, there's a lot more going on.

[00:43:35] I think there's a lot of different factors that we like you've just touched on. But I feel like a lot of it is all still connected when you go into your cryptids and you go into your paranormal and your UFOs.

[00:43:48] I feel like somehow one way or the other, a lot of it is all interconnected one way. I don't know how to explain it, like how it's possible. But I feel like that somehow they've all got some sort of connection to each other.

[00:44:02] Yeah, I can't prove it. It's just my opinion. No, well, you can't really prove anything in this field, right?

[00:44:12] I mean, I know that the Sasquatch researchers for one are hoping that they're going to lay a body on the slab one of these days or have some other kind of irrefutable evidence that there's a physical creature.

[00:44:26] And all the UFO hunters are looking for the crash flying saucers and stuff.

[00:44:34] But excuse me, when you start to look at these things, you know, the other thing that pops into my brain when you start talking about the connection between the things is this whole idea of the trickster.

[00:44:53] Yeah, because it seems like a lot of times in these cases something is playing with us. You know, you have had these scenarios. A good example of this in UFO lore and I'm kind of getting off the topic of the force holder guys, but that's fine.

[00:45:18] In UFO lore, if you look at the history of it, it seems like the craft that are being seen are just a little bit beyond the capabilities of the people that are seeing them.

[00:45:34] You know, when you talk about the late 1800s, you had airships and you had these guys who were flying. You had what appeared to be people flying around in what looked like a dirigible except there wasn't any such thing at that point in time.

[00:45:52] You know, and they were doing things like landing on people's farms and asking for water and doing all this sort of bizarre stuff, right? And so, you know, the age of aviation came about and the Wright brothers and all that stuff.

[00:46:14] You move forward, you get into the 1930s and before World War II, you had the ghost rockets in the Nordic countries where people were reporting seeing these rockets that were flying around.

[00:46:31] Now, during World War II, of course, we started to get V2 rockets and you got the age of the ocean and all that sort of stuff going on. During World War II itself, the UFOs morphed again and turned into foo fighters.

[00:46:49] You know, these globes of light that were these anomalous lights that were being seen by both Allied and Axis pilots. And, you know, the Allied pilots all thought it was a German secret weapon and the Axis pilots all thought it was, you know, an Allied secret weapon.

[00:47:11] Nobody actually knew what the heck it was. And then you drop into the 50s and, you know, you have now we have jet fighters and we have all this stuff, you know, on this more advanced technology and suddenly UFOs become flying saucers.

[00:47:29] And it keeps going like that, you know.

[00:47:32] I mean, we develop more advanced aerial technology and fighter jets and those kinds of things in the UFOs change shape and become giant triangles that fly over people's houses or, you know, now we've got these tic-tac things flying around in the Pacific Ocean.

[00:47:53] It always seems like it's just a little bit ahead of what, you know, what we're capable of doing. It's like it's playing with us. So, you know, I always, you know, I don't always but I sometimes feel like there's an intelligence that's throwing this stuff at us.

[00:48:14] And, you know, I've raised the possibility and other podcasts that, you know, we have a situation now particularly here in the West where we don't really have any rights of passage.

[00:48:28] You know, back in, you know, the tribal times, you know, people would go off and they'd go through ordeals and whatever and discover their place in the society in the tribal society.

[00:48:41] We don't have that anymore. We don't have, you know, a right of passage from, you know, childhood into adulthood unless you consider things like high school graduation or college graduation or something along that line. But it doesn't have the deep spiritual significance that it had back then.

[00:49:03] And most importantly, one of the things that happened during these rights of passage in tribal cultures was that certain individuals were recognized as having a strong connection to the spirit world. You know, some people call them shaman.

[00:49:23] You know, there are a number of names for them but it's called spirit workers. These spirit workers had this strong connection to the spirit world. They were recognized for this.

[00:49:35] They trained under other people who had this connection and they became the healers and the seers and so forth of the tribe. We don't have that anymore. We don't have any way of recognizing these people.

[00:49:51] If someone has these talents, these spirit worker type talents, it only gets recognized by accident sometime or if it's just so apparent that they can't avoid it.

[00:50:07] I have to wonder though, if some of these anomalous experiences that people are having, whether it's UFO sightings, whether it's Sasquatch encounters, lake monster encounters for that matter.

[00:50:21] One of the things that we see in experiencer reports is that a certain number of people are like, oh, well, I saw this interesting thing and they go on and they live their lives.

[00:50:33] A certain number of people are like, or the opinion that oh, I saw this interesting thing and they avoid whatever it was that got them into this interesting thing. You know, Sasquatch witnesses may start to avoid the wilderness after seeing one of these critters.

[00:50:52] But a certain number of people have the experience of having their paradigm completely shifted when they encounter the anomalous. They suddenly become aware that reality isn't exactly what they thought it was. And this puts them on a path that leads them into.

[00:51:19] We see this a lot with near death experiences too, where people come back from these experiences and it changes their lives. It changes their paradigm completely because they understand in a very real way that this other world is real.

[00:51:37] So I wonder if some of these anomalous experiences and some of the experiencers that we see out there are not having these anomalous experiences are forming initiatic experiences, moving people into contact with the other side or the other world or whatever you want to call it.

[00:51:59] The zero point field or whatever. So it's a, you know, and that is a connection that I think is worth pursuing too. But yeah, I do sometimes have a really strong feeling that there's an intelligence behind these things. And sometimes it's just fooling with us.

[00:52:23] The reason I do this podcast and the reason we're talking tonight is because in 2007, I had a very strange experience with an upright walking canine in the middle of the road 15 feet from me. Wow.

[00:52:39] So when you mentioned that earlier and you just went when you just talk stuff, you were just mentioning like I didn't believe in any of this stuff back in 2007.

[00:52:50] I was a skeptic and I still try and say I'm a skeptic, but I'm very open minded because when you see something completely illogical that shouldn't make any like it's not possible. But you're seeing that plain as day. You cannot. It literally changes how you view the world.

[00:53:13] So I agree to that. It shakes your worldview up. Does it shake your worldview up in a big way. Now, as I said, I have always been open to the idea that you know that these anomalous things are real.

[00:53:29] So I don't come at it from a so much. I guess my brain is just wired that way. Most of my experiential stuff has been more visionary.

[00:53:45] So I don't really, you know, talk too much about it because you know most people you don't want to tell people hearing voices sometimes or seeing things that aren't there. It can get you into serious trouble depending on what you're talking with.

[00:54:05] But, you know, I mean I lived in Western New York for a time before I moved to Canada and lived in a little house not too far from the shore of Lake Erie and right across the street from a 700 acre state park.

[00:54:31] And I had a couple of kind of bizarre experiences. One of the things that happened to me on a regular basis there, I'm not afraid of the dark.

[00:54:47] You know, I've spent nights out on my own minimalist camping in like the Superstition Mountains in Arizona which is one of the creepier places on the planet at night. You know, I'm not afraid of the dark.

[00:55:08] But while I was living in this house, every fall and every spring for about one week, I could not bear to have the curtains open at night. Now any other time, I was fine.

[00:55:35] You know, you have curtains open wherever you want, whatever, you know, throw the windows open, whatever. During that one week, for whatever reason, I had to have the windows shut and the curtains drawn after sunset. And I have absolutely no idea why that would be.

[00:55:55] You know, it was there was the strong feeling in my mind that there was something out there and I didn't want to see it. And I have, again, I have no idea what that was about. The other weird thing that happened to me when I lived there.

[00:56:13] I commuted to work every morning so I would, I rode the bus. So I would get up early and I would walk down my street which is a quarter of a mile down to the intersection there.

[00:56:28] And there was a bus that ran up that street and picked me up and basically delivered me right to the front door of my office.

[00:56:39] Which is very nice. It took me an hour or so to get to work, but it was nice because I could sit and read or whatever. The interesting thing about this though was I was walking around, walking down that road one morning.

[00:56:55] And I heard something in, there's very dense forest like right across the street. As I said, there was a straight park there.

[00:57:06] There's something in the forest that huffed and it was so loud that you know, the thing that jumped into my mind and this is, this is bizarre. The thing that jumped into my mind was, you know, watch movies you see dragons, right?

[00:57:26] The thing that jumped into my mind was a dragon huffing making this loud sound. Again, I have no idea what that was. There's not an animal in that area.

[00:57:41] I mean we had plenty of deer, we had fox, we had coyotes, we had raccoons and possums and all of those sorts of things. Nothing that was large enough to make a sound like that. I have no idea what that sound was and I never heard it again.

[00:58:00] So I didn't have a chance to track it down. One of the things that I tell people is, you know, if you hear anomalous sounds out in the wilderness, you need to keep going back because a lot of times you can figure out what it is.

[00:58:16] I had this happen with a crow call when I moved to Canada. I was out walking my dogs and I heard the sound that was just bizarre. This is kind of grating sound and not a sound that I was familiar with.

[00:58:37] But I kept hearing it as I'd go out to walk the dogs. Eventually I figured out that our local crows, our local murderer of crows had a very distinct call that was unlike, you know, and I've lived around crows and ravens almost all of my life.

[00:58:56] It was unlike anything I'd heard with any crow or raven that I'd met in the States. But there it was, you know, and it was making, sitting up on top of a building making this very bizarre sound. You know, so I mean a lot.

[00:59:14] I guess I could be classified as a believer in the paranormal, but I also try to keep a mind as to what kinds of physical things could be out there making those sounds.

[00:59:31] I mean if you've ever heard a northern hawk owl making its sound, you'd think there was a raptor coming to get you. You know, right out of Jurassic Park. Very spooky noise and it's moving around out in the trees and stuff.

[00:59:46] You're like, what in the world is that? I've spent some time outdoors and, you know, I always kind of giggle when, you know, I watch some of these shows and, you know, oh, that must be a Sasquatch. It's like, and it's very clearly coyote howling in the distance.

[01:00:06] But you know, you have to entertain people. I was saying they got to make it entertaining. I feel like majority of the shows are embellished enough just to keep people's interest. Yeah, unfortunately so.

[01:00:22] You know, I mean, but you know, you have to understand that these shows are entertainment.

[01:00:29] You know, and you know, while we would wish that they were a little more educational about some things, you know, they are entertaining and they do attract a certain number of people into, you know, investigating more deeply whatever it is that they're watching about, whether it's ghost hunting or Sasquatch or whatever.

[01:00:52] So, you know, I mean, some good comes of it, I'm sure. I think it helps people into this side, like more open to the possibility of the strangeness.

[01:01:04] I don't know if they fully believe, but I think it makes them a little bit more accepted towards it, I guess. Well, yeah, I mean, I think one of the things that is advantageous about these shows is that it cracks the, the ridicule factor a little bit.

[01:01:28] It used to be, you know, when I was a kid, you know, even as a young adult and so forth, you know, if you said that you'd seen a Sasquatch or UFO or

[01:01:41] you'd had a ghost encounter or whatever, people looked at you like, you know, you needed to go check yourself into the nearest psych ward.

[01:01:49] And that's, while that is the case with some people still, it is, it's true that I think these shows have made more people aware that people are having these experiences.

[01:02:08] And while they may not personally believe in it or, you know, have any interest in it, it makes, maybe makes people a little bit more accepting of the experience.

[01:02:23] Yeah, it's just like, because you see, it's like, you know, the argument that a lot of people make, you know, thousands of people at this point have seen Sasquatch, right? You know, literally laid eyes on this creature. They got to be seeing something. Yeah.

[01:02:41] And while, you know, the scientists might want you to believe that all of these are misidentified black bears or delusions. Enough of it, the witnesses are credible hunters, law enforcement people, special forces soldiers and so forth. And so forth.

[01:03:01] None of these people, you know, particularly the hunters, they know what the hell a bear looks like. And they're, you know, the idea that they're misidentifying a bear is frankly ludicrous. I was going to say the whole bear thing pisses me off because. The whole bear thing.

[01:03:23] It's just, I find it laughable. It's like, I'm sorry. I know what a bear looks like. I'm not going to mistake a bear, even a bear standing on its hind legs for, you know, a massive eight foot tall bipedal primate. I'm sorry, that's not going to happen.

[01:03:43] I know what a bear looks like. In the same manner. And bears don't have the same fluidity that's described in Sasquatch encounters and they have snouts. And their shoulders aren't right for the Sasquatch description. I mean, there's just a whole host of things.

[01:04:01] So, you know, that's just one of those BS scientific materialist things that get thrown out there periodically to muddy the water. And I've totally forgot where I was going with this.

[01:04:17] But, you know, it is, it's a situation where, you know, with these, these TV shows that, you know, I think people are becoming a little more accepting of the experience.

[01:04:31] I mean, if you look at the difference in attitudes toward UFOs and UFO experiencers in the 60s and 70s versus UFOs and UFO experiencers now.

[01:04:45] I mean, there was a time when, you know, if the news was reporting on UFO, you almost inevitably got the theme from the X-Files playing in the background and it was thoroughly tongue in cheek.

[01:05:00] Right? Now, you know, we've got national news playing the tic-tac videos and taking it completely seriously. And, you know, basically saying, okay, we don't know what this is, but there it is. Our Navy jets are chasing these things around and we don't know what they are.

[01:05:19] Big difference in attitude. So, I think some of that wall of materialism that, you know, these things can't possibly exist because we say they can't exist is starting to break down. The stigma isn't as strong as it used to be when people come forward with stuff too.

[01:05:43] That's, you know, it's kind of like why I do the show. I've said it before is I never felt like I could talk about the thing that I saw.

[01:05:51] So I wanted to make a show and talk to people to solve the same type of things because I never felt like I could talk about it.

[01:06:00] So I wanted to give a place for people that could like where they could come on and talk about it because in my mind, if I would have brought it up, everyone laughed at you think you're crazy because that's typical for what happens when you see strange things.

[01:06:16] Yeah, there's a very strong ridicule factor. And it's still, I mean, I'm convinced that many, many, many more people have seen things they couldn't explain that have reported them.

[01:06:33] Because for every person who comes forward and makes a report, I'll bet you, I mean, and this is completely unscientific. I could can't prove this, but I'll bet you there's three or four more that never reported their experience. Yeah, because what will people think?

[01:06:50] Yeah, I mean, particularly when you have people who are in, you know, in professional fields and so forth, they're afraid they're going to lose their jobs if this stuff gets out.

[01:07:03] You know, if it comes out that they saw Sasquatch or, you know, they had a UFO experience or whatever. And in some cases, that could still happen.

[01:07:17] I don't think it's quite as prevalent as it used to be, but I mean, I can see certain workplaces where that kind of thing just wouldn't be tolerated. No.

[01:07:28] So in your man wolf encounter, did you feel threatened by this creature or was it just a thing that was there? I can tell you the whole thing when we're off air that way. Okay.

[01:07:44] I don't like taking up my episodes with interviews or someone else with my own encounter, so I can tell you about it when we're done with the episode.

[01:07:51] My curiosity is, you know, it seems that most people who encounter these creatures seem to view them as aggressive, but I've talked to one experiencer who has been in the process of being threatened. And I think that's a very different attitude toward it. I don't know.

[01:08:12] We can talk about that off air. Yeah, for the listeners right now, I didn't take it as aggressive because I was so close to it standing face to face with it that it literally could have got me if it wanted to. 15 feet from it.

[01:08:30] It just crawls down and went off on its way like it wanted to get away from me. So I didn't, and everyone's like, Oh, were you afraid? I was like, No. They're like, Well, that's why I left your lunch. You weren't afraid of it.

[01:08:42] Like I would just confuse. So I was just trying to figure out what the hell this thing is. What was that? Why am I seeing it? All that.

[01:08:52] I've told it on other podcasts and stuff before and everyone always tells me like it's the most bizarre story they've actually heard from someone when it comes to like just a sequence of things that how it went all, went all up.

[01:09:04] I'm not sure what it's all about because I wasn't the only one that saw it. So, but yeah, we'll talk about that here in a few minutes because we've been talking for about an hour.

[01:09:13] So I didn't, I want to go back and talk about your books real quick before we wrap this up. Okay. So you want to let the audience know where they can find your books at and everything else? Sure.

[01:09:27] I'm all of my paranormal stuff is published under Beyond the Frey Publishing. It's a little outfit out of Las Vegas and my books are all available on Amazon. They're available. You can get them as either paperbacks or the Kindle version.

[01:09:48] And if you happen to be a Kindle Unlimited subscriber, you can read them for free. So that's, that's hard to beat. As far as contact with me goes, my two major social media outlets are Facebook and Instagram. Kind of giving up on Twitter. I just can't keep up.

[01:10:09] I just can't keep up. I, you know, everybody thinks, you know, oh well, authors make lots of money. It's like, eh, not really. I work a day job like everybody else. And, you know, I do this, you know, part time in my spare time.

[01:10:26] So, you know, I do a Facebook where you can find me WT Watson author page. On Instagram, I have an old handle that I use. It's a coroner, C-U-R-U-N-I-R 6-0. So I'm always glad to hear from people.

[01:10:50] And, you know, I sometimes get citing reports from people online, but, you know, mostly I think people like to follow and see what I'm up to. Yeah. And I'm happy to hear from folks that have read my books and such.

[01:11:07] You can shoot me all your links in an email. I will include all that in the show notes for anyone listening. They just can go there and click on them and take it to where they need to go. Great. Well, do. Well, Travis.

[01:11:21] I'll send you my author bio too. Okay. No, I didn't include that too. But I want to say again, I do appreciate you coming on here and talking with me. It's been a pleasure. Oh, absolutely. It's been, it's been great. Thanks for having me. Not a problem.

[01:11:36] Thank you for coming on here and for everyone out there listening. Make sure to check out Travis's books and make sure to hit him up on social media. But on that note, we're going to roll out here. So thanks for listening. Good night. And that's the show everyone.

[01:11:58] I really hope you guys enjoyed the conversations. If you would like to be a guest on 10 foil tells remember to send an email to 10 foil tells podcast at gmail.com or go to the contact section of 10 foil tells.com. Just get your message to me.

[01:12:10] We'll get some schedule for future episode. And just remember the truth lies in the stories we share the connections we make stay curious, stay open minded. Thank you all for joining us on this journey. And until next time, keep questioning, keep seeking and keep exploring

[01:12:24] the unknown. Good night everyone. But the truth is out there like an alien spark. You have all sightings got the whole world shut. Conspiracies unfold like a story in a book. Media control trying to keep us blind. But I won't be fooled gonna use my own mind.

[01:13:03] In history they want us to know the secrets they hide. The truth they won't show. Down in a society they keep us in chains. But I'm standing tall just time to break the reins. Media control trying to keep us blind.

[01:13:43] But I won't be fooled gonna use my own mind. In history they want us to know the secrets they hide. The truth they won't show. Down in a society they keep us in chains. But I'm standing tall just time to break the reins.